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I am currently about 36hrs post DDay and my mind is still a mess. I am working on finding a therapist ASAP and meanwhile can't make up my mind on whether this relationship is salvageable or if I should cut my losses and get out.

To preface:

Over the course of the last year/year and a half my wife and I began on a path of intimacy decline. We have been together 5 years, and married for 4, and everything was great for a long time. Once I became seriously invested in my career and our finances recently, I began to experience a lot of discontentment in my day-to-day life. I haved always worked on myself physically with skin care, working out, and small things for self-improvement, however, despite my physical upkeep I had been grappling with a steep mental decline into apathy and depression. My wife had addressed this multiple times and even suggested/begged that I/we seek counseling due to this as well as what had essentially become a dead bedroom. It even got to the point where she had threatened to leave due to my unwillingness to improve. At the time I had also been struggling with resentment and doubt regarding our relationship as well and was unsure if I even wanted to take the steps to improve. Admittedly, it had been like pulling teeth to get me out of bed or to stop playing video games until 3am so that we could do things together, and the few times recently that we have gone and done things together, I'm reminded and briefly brought back to all of the wonderful times, the intimacy, the vacations, and wonderful moments from the earlier days of our relationship. This preface is not to add any sort of admonishment or justification to WS or to even place any type of fault on myself, but rather to offer an honest and objective evaluation of the state of our M pre-DDay. I want to make it clear that I understand it is not my fault and this was an intentional decision made by WS, not by me, but am remaining as fully honest as possible to paint a realistic picture of what it had become.

I came home from work earlier this week and after seeing an flirtatious message appear on her screen from someone on a messaging app, I ended up going through her computer later that evening while she was asleep. I found all the DMs she had been sending to the guy including discussions referring to (but not explicitly containing) nudes being exchanged and a potential upcoming trip to visit him in person a few states away. I did not scroll through the conversation thread in its entirety but saw and got screenshots of plenty/the jist of it. There were many allusions to photos being saved to each others camera rolls and messages of them falling asleep to each others' texts, often because my wife had been sleeping on the couch a lot recently.

I waited until yesterday to confront her while I was at work and from what I could tell she seemed to be pretty transparent about it when questioned. She explained that she had been talking to him about how she felt and the decline of our relationship dynamic and that it started out as playful banter/flirting that got out of hand. She broke down and insisted that she had no actual intentions of meeting up with him nor did she have any feelings towards him but liked the attention she got. She also said that the nudes she had been sending to him weren't hers (something that I was aware she had done in the past in an unrelated situation so I admit could be possible but that I don't necessarily believe) She admitted that this crossed the boundaries of our relationship and expressed a level of remorse or guilt (I feel as if I'm not in a good headspace to be able to tell which). She claimed it had only been going on for less than a month (She met him in January and said this didn't start until the beginning of March) and offered to show me that there are no intimate photos of him saved on her phone as well as show that she had not sent any nudes to him. I told her that I don't really believe her anymore since photos and messages can be deleted and that it ends or I'm 100% gone without exception and she once again insisted that she had no desire to be with him.

Per my request, she came clean to the AP and admitted that she had been leading him on and blocked him on everything. He in turn blocked her and in a fit of rage, drove across state lines overnight to show up at our place after I had left. The police were called by her friends who were staying there with her and she said she is likely going to file a restraining order. I told her I am not sure how to proceed at this point and I am not in a good place to determine if R or D is the way to proceed at the moment. I also told her that no matter what road we take, we both need to seek IT/IC as our next step. She agreed obviously, and claimed she wanted to take steps to repair it and does not want our relationship to end (Undoubtedly wants her cake and eat it too).

At the moment I am staying with my parents until I can sort some stuff out and my mind is still racing. I have been reaching out to various facilities and am trying to see a therapist ASAP to help get some of my mind back together. I advised that she do the same which she has agreed to and is in the process of doing. Almost hourly I change my mind on the R vs. D road and whether this is even salvagable at this point. The few close family and friends I've spoken with have expressed that they don't think choosing either option would be the right or wrong answer in this case.

The biggest thing eating at me is knowing that it likely would have escalated if I had not caught her and not being able to differientiate between remorse and guilt to know if she truly recognizes the hurt she put me through. I want to be more angry than I am but all I feel is sad and numb. I wish this never happened and I don't know where to go next.

Concerning the doubts I was having prior to DDay, I now suddenly feel that my doubts were unfounded and that I did not in fact want to my relationship to end, and especially not like this, but that realization has now come a day late and a dollar short. In a way, that part is what feels most like poetic irony in the whole situation.

[This message edited by JohnTerriblefate at 7:46 PM, Thursday, March 27th]

I would tell you to give it a little time for the shock to wear off before making any big decisions. Plenty of other people will be giving you some good ideas and advice. Mine is I probably don’t believe this was just messaging. I know there are a lot of crazy people out there, but I have a hard time believing someone drove from another state to confront someone they were just txting. One of your first must haves from her ( if you choose not to divorce immediately) would be a complete and truthful timeline of the affair. Any lies or anything left out would result in filing for divorce. Back this up with a polygraph.

And how would he know where you live if it’s just txting? People don’t usually give out their address at that point. Guess there’s ways to find it if you have a full name, but kinda suspicious.

[This message edited by OhItsYou at 7:21 PM, Thursday, March 27th]

I appreciate your insight. I agree that the wound is still very raw and the shock is still in full swing. Some moments are better than others. Two things I can try my best to contextualize with what I know as well as what I've been told so far. (taken with a grain of salt)

Mine is I probably don’t believe this was just messaging. I know there are a lot of crazy people out there, but I have a hard time believing someone drove from another state to confront someone they were just txting.

He lives at least 8 hours away based on the location he had sent her in the messages which is supported by what she told me. I'll agree that it's definitely possible there could have been more to it but at this moment it seems unlikely as I work from home and can count on one hand the number of days in the last several months where I was away for more than 8hrs while she was also at home alone. There was a planned meeting in April in their messages that WS was planning on purchasing plane tickets for due to the distance, so while possible, this part seems unlikely to me but I will post an update if I am proven wrong on this.

And how would he know where you live if it’s just txting? People don’t usually give out their address at that point. Guess there’s ways to find it if you have a full name, but kinda suspicious.

I asked for an explanation of this as well and the response was that he was apparently supposed to mail her a birthday gift (it just passed a couple weeks ago).

And how would he know where you live if it’s just txting? People don’t usually give out their address at that point. Guess there’s ways to find it if you have a full name, but kinda suspicious.

This was also the first thought that crossed my mind. Also, the sexting is fairly new so why would the AP drive all the way to your house to confront your wife. Did it get serious that quickly? Or there's a possibility there is more to this than she led you to believe or admitted.

This was also the first thought that crossed my mind. Also, the sexting is fairly new so why would the AP drive all the way to your house to confront your wife. Did it get serious that quickly? Or there's a possibility there is more to this than she led you to believe or admitted.

Yes. Entirely possible that there is more to this. From my assessment of the messages, I do believe however that things just moved incredibly quickly. Referring to my above response, the "planned meeting" in April was something that had been planned well in advance as a big meetup with several friends. When these plans were made it was a couple months ago now, and I was/am aware of these friends and do fully believe that the friend trip was a real thing, however it very well could have just been a front for her (or a convienent excuse) to be in a closer proximity to AP. I will have to get a clearer, full timeline from her, but at the time (and she still maintains) she stands by the friend trip narrative. Time will tell if this is the truth.

AP lives fairly close to where the meetup was meant to take place so my personal take on it was that as the trip got closer, things escalated quicker and quicker as to AP the prospect of meeting began to look more like a real possibility. I am mostly unsure of the levels of obfuscation surrounding this trip and if AP was the true intention behind it all long. Entirely reasonable assumption.

I’m only about 6 months from DDay myself. It’s a similar situation, as it involves sexting.

If I could go back in time and give myself advice, I would definitely say that not making any rash decisions is a smart move.

You can’t take things that you do or say back, so be careful with your words and your actions.

Unfortunately, I do not have more to share with you. For me, this situation has been one of the most difficult of my life. The last 6 months has been a roller coaster ride that doesn’t appear to be stopping anytime soon.

I think talking to an IC is a good idea.

You had doubts prior.

Your WS went to this extreme while you were at a low point. I think that is relevant too.

M heal. WS figure out their brokeness and get boundaries. BS show grace and heal. M 2.0 is built. R is a success.

Sorry, but that is the exception not the norm. Just being straight with you here.

I agree now is not the time for major life altering decisions either.

So you clearly had something that was bringing you down. I think it is important to work through that in IC.

Your depression could be the result of you, her or both of you. Ideally you get more understanding what was at the core of those things. It is important because you R,D, rugsweep. . .that will follow you around.

You are doing the right things. Be authentic with yourself and it will become clearer what the next step will be.

Sorry you are here, but glad you found us

Could you clarify? You said they met in January. Was that in person? How did she know this man? She sent nudes, but of other women? So he didn’t know what she actually looked like? He had her address because he planned on mailing her a birthday present and this is credible because her birthday was two weeks ago? Did she get his present?

Could you clarify? You said they met in January. Was that in person? How did she know this man? She sent nudes, but of other women? So he didn’t know what she actually looked like? He had her address because he planned on mailing her a birthday present and this is credible because her birthday was two weeks ago? Did she get his present?

Apologies if my posts are all over the place, I will try to provide additional details and context behind WS and AP's situation. This is the timeline as I currently understand it so far, not from WS.

They met online through mututal friends who WS and AP would video chat with. Some of these friends were the ones that she was planning on meeting up with at a location that happened to be in close proximity to AP. WS has a lot of body-image issues and the claim is that AP had only ever seen from the neck up in the video calls. I have reason to believe but no concrete evidence that there may have been more intimate video calls during the window she is claiming this happened. Possibly true or just BS paranoia.

In the past, in a different and unrelated situation, she has sent nudes of other women to people (Which I have seen and confirmed in that previous situation were not hers). These are the same images she claims to have sent to AP, however, I do not have proof of this at this time as that is still a pending conversation that needs to happen at some point. Her claim is that the only nudes/"body" portion AP ever saw were pictures of the other women. If things started to escalate at the beginning of March as she claims, it aligns with her birthday that was only a couple weeks ago. She has had many other friends and family from other states mail her birthday gifts before so it is not super unusual that someone who she is receiving and thriving off of a lot of attention from would want to send her a birthday gift as well but to my knowledge, no, she never recieved one, but this is another aspect I currently can't confirm.

[This message edited by JohnTerriblefate at 11:31 PM, Thursday, March 27th]

Concerning the doubts I was having prior to DDay, I now suddenly feel that my doubts were unfounded and that I did not in fact want to my relationship to end, and especially not like this, but that realization has now come a day late and a dollar short. In a way, that part is what feels most like poetic irony in the whole situation.

I think it's worth pointing out just a bit more clarification here as well. Over the last couple months things were actually starting to look like they could improve and I was slowly beginning to pull myself out of the funk I had been in.

We were gradually spending some more time together (which was pretty nice) and slowly addressing some of the doubts that I had been building up + our dead bedroom. I know at the moment it is for the best that we exist in separate spaces, but the more I reflect and remain away, the more I do think/realize I really did enjoy being around WS and got comfort from her presence, despite the doubts I may have been feeling at the time. My main question is, is there anything here that's salvageable?

[This message edited by JohnTerriblefate at 11:40 PM, Thursday, March 27th]

Welcome to SI. First, there are some posts pinned to the top of the forum that we encourage new members to read. There are also some other posts that aren't pinned but do have bull's eye icons to stand out that are a great resource. The Healing Library has a lot of resources, too.

If you can, IC (individual counseling) with a betrayal trauma specialist can be helpful. You have suffered trauma, so please practice self-care during this time.

My main question is, is there anything here that's salvageable?

It may be too early to tell. Many times, it's the WSs (wayward spouse's) actions or inactions that tilt one way or the other. Some people also feel that infidelity is an absolute deal-breaker and go straight to D (divorce).

Your WW (wayward wife) also needs IC to work on becoming a safe partner. BS (betrayed spouse - that's you) heals the BS, the WS heals the WS and then you can work on rebuilding the relationship.

Your WW should read How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair by Linda MacDonald. It's fairly short and is a nice blueprint. Another good book is Not Just Friends by Dr. Shirley Glass.

Your WW had a bunch of other decisions she could have made, but she chose to cheat. Right now, you should watch her actions and not listen to her words. For example, if she finds an IC and reads the suggested books, that can be a good sign. If she won't provide a written timeline of the A (affair) if you ask for one or she finds another AP (affair partner), then it's not so good.

I gave myself 6 month increments, but you can settle on what you like. I set up some boundaries/consequences and went from there.

It takes time and healing and you're probably still in shock right now. Take care of yourself because infidelity is the worst.

Yes, it may be salvageable. But it is too soon to come to any conclusions. First, you may not have all the facts. Until she comes clean you can’t really heal. Her story is shaky. It may be true but experience tells me that when a deceiver is caught they minimize their culpability. Others have already advised about this, so I won’t go further than just advising to stay aware that there may be more effluent coming your way. I sincerely hope not, but my brother, keep your seatbelt fastened. Second, you don’t know how you are going to feel when you come out of shock. Third, you don’t know if your wife is actually done with this pos, nor whether she is going to be remorseful or do the work to make you feel safe being married to her. Read leafields’ advice and take it to heart. She states it far better than I.

My wife had an EA with a former boyfriend. Dday was more than 29 years ago. I think about it every blessed day. But we are still together and living good lives. If I had evidence that it had turned physical, I would have divorced her. (Or so I have told myself. But I have read so many accounts on this site where a BS said that and then changed their minds and reconciled.) That was my bridge too far. You will have to figure out where your boundaries are, but right now you are too wounded to make major decisions about the future of your marriage. Let me leave you with a more hopeful thought. Everyone is capable of redemption. There is nothing wrong with hope, but don’t take it like a drug. Get in a healthier place and see if she can prove worthy of you.

I really appreciate all your advice and questions so far.

Update:

Sometime yesterday night, ~50hrs post DDay, I decided it was very much difficult to remain at my parent's house moping around and feeling sorry. Possibly even more so than returning to the broken home, so that's what I did, but it is of course subject to change again. I also already have my first of many IC sessions lined up, I am just waiting to confirm the initial appointment date.

I laid out some very firm boundaries with WS surrounding my return to the home.

- I am not here because of you, I am here because I need the remaining comforts of my own home for my mental wellness.

- From this point forward expect nothing but selfishness from me as I work on myself, and it would be in your best interest to do the same.

- We can interact and coexist amicably, but don't expect things to be as they were before, the marriage is not currently existent and we are roomates at best.

- Sleeping arrangements are separate, and we can rotate rooms as appropriate

- I need a full and cohesive timeline of the A as well as full transparency about everything

Following everyone + leafields' advice, I will try to continue to hold off on making any major decisions at this time as I understand that my mind is still in shambles at the moment. I'm expecting I may need those 6 month increments to evaluate where I stand and what happens next, but right now all I feel is hurt and uncertainty. Only time will tell.

[This message edited by JohnTerriblefate at 12:52 PM, Friday, March 28th]

That’s great start to your list of requirements.
I wound not trust any timeline to be accurate and not full of omissions without the threat of divorce if she fails a polygraph based on her timeline. However, do not lay that requirement at her feet unless you are fully prepared to execute your ultimatum. Backpeddling is the worse thing you can do to yourself at this time.

Sounds like you are heading in a good direction. Good for you. Here’s a classic thread from nomadlady that I wish I had on my Dday. https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/514479/calling-all-bss/

Hey OP, sorry you are here. I don't post much in the JFO forum as others tend to give better advice than me. As my tag says, I'm an outlier, so take what I have with a grain of salt. It is only my opinion, but it's good to have plurality.

I feel that the default reaction to infidelity should be D (divorce) since the WS has already engaged in breach of contract, the M is already over. By taking a wait and see approach, a BS is actually sending the message that they are still in the M. (Its like shopping for a car and comm7nicating to the salesperson that you really like the car but are a lityle unsure. In contrast, I like the movie Speed where Keanu shoots the hostage in the leg and removes the option the hostage taker was counting on. It's more of an "oh shit,I didn't know you could do that" moment. I think now they call it FAFO. One book I recommend is Sun Tzu's the Art of War as reading. It talks about power and perception.

You see, I don't think that there really three choices, R (reconcilliation), wait or D, because waiting seems to similar to staying for the WS, at least its a cousin to staying. Often, IMHO they feel that they can wait you out, trickle truth you, keep you tethered until they come around, assuming it wasnt an exit affair. If you choose to end the reationship (at the very least in your heart and mind) then you flip the script and are now in a position of power, deciding how and what happens next. Then the onus to fix the relationship falls completely on the WS as they know the clock is ticking. They are much more likely to have what we call rheir Damascus moment. The kicker is that you must be ready to end it, otherwise you become a paper tiger, a security guard who tells you to stop or he'll be forced to say stop again.

In mybexperience, people will often hold beliefs or attitudes that cost them nothing, that come with no actual price. I call it theoretical morality. It is only when a belief or action costs them something, usually money or time, that we can really see if they actually believe it. Just look at how many APs dump the WS once they are outed. All the lies come out and it turns out that they never really intended to leave their spouse. It's entertaining to see the shock on a Ws face when they realize that they had been played...but I digress.

Your WW sounds like an attention hound who likes to play psychological games, toying with her APs. The photos she senda indicate that she likes eliciting a reactio without investing herself. The photos of other women provide her with both a sense of safety and a plausable argument in her mind that she did not cross some imagined hatd boundary. In fact, she reminds me of an internet troll who hides behind a keyboard feeling clever. This is a huge red flag as it may indicate a far deeper mental or personality issue. Luke an addict, she will move the hard boundary as her normal behaviour no longer provides the same stimulation.

But even deeper than her bebaviour is your behaviour in the M (marriage). Your dead bedroom, long hours of gaming, depression, all lead me to suspect that you may be deeply unhappy in your M and that you might have been white knuckling it long before Dday, something to explore in IC. You see, I was M for 27 year before I filed. It was only after many years of detoxing from the relationship and really looking inwards that I realized that I had been deeply unhappy in my M and masking that behaviour with work, hobbies, renos, and even porn. I had built a world to retreat into because I could not admit my real world was making me so unhappy.

One book I would highly recommend is Cheating in a Nutshell. The authors use research and personal experience to create an easy to read text. They have a bias which aligns with mine, but the real value lies in their approach in explaining to the BS what is happening in their mind and body and normalizing it. Theyvwalk you through why your body is doing crazy shit. Reading it made me feel like I was normal and allowed me yo forgive myself for my less than ideal reactions and behaviours.

I'm many years out now and at a place I can now call myself healed. There are scars but I'm good now. For me, D was the best option. It might not be for you. I hope that there isn't more to your story, but prepare yourself for more. More often than not, there is. It's just human nature to minimize. Good luck. Hoping for good things for you.

Just wanted to provide a quick update as DDay was nearly a week ago now:

My emotions have stabilized a lot more since the initial post, and while the rollercoaster doesn't appear to be stopping anytime soon, the bad moments feel a little less bad.

WS and I are talking a little more every day. Things are expectedly different now and I'm remaining quite guarded, yet amicable, but both of us are in agreement that rugsweeping would be the worst outcome from this and have expressed comittment to doing some soul-searching. I have expressed to her that I'm currently dealing with a lot of triggers and that some moments I'm more open to communication than others. She seems to understand this.

I have a consultation today or tomorrow to start IC this week and I'm looking forward to it honestly. WS starts seeing her counselor on Thursday and has agreed to provide a full, transparent, and detailed document timelining the entire A with the help of her counselor. She's in the process of getting the restraining order finalized against AP and claims she wants to recenter herself and figure out what she wants out of her life, career, and relationships going forward, which is something she hopes IC will help with. I hope the same for myself.

I still think I want to follow leafield's advice and take my time, likely over the next 6 months, to sit on this, heal, and evaluate. One of the great difficulties I'm currently facing is dissenting voices from friends and family, well-meaning, but also sort of encouraging me to "figure it out" (some pro-D, a few pro-R, and some neutral.) which has ultimately proven to be quite distressing. I will try to continue to post updates through this process for anyone that is interested in following this.

One thing that's missing here (or maybe I missed it), is an explanation of what was going on previously when she was sending nudes of other women - as if the photos were of her (right?). You know about this now, but were you aware of it when she was sending them? If you found out later how did you respond and what did you do as a couple to get passed it. If you knew while she was sending them what were the circumstances? Could she now be thinking this EA is not that big a deal because of that past experience.

That part of your shared past seems pretty important to understanding the current situation.

[This message edited by Lostinmarriage at 1:21 AM, Tuesday, April 1st]

You know about this now, but were you aware of it when she was sending them? If you found out later how did you respond and what did you do as a couple to get passed it.

At the time I was aware of it and the nature of it in that situation was more of a "These women's bodies look like mine/I wish I was comfortable like/looked like this" type deal to myself and some others she was close with. It was a different situation from this and didn't necessarily cause issues at the time. I can't recall in great detail as this was a while back but I seem to recall them being sort of closer to what I might consider boudoir type photos.

[This message edited by JohnTerriblefate at 1:47 AM, Tuesday, April 1st]

A couple of points...
Your last post might point towards the crux of the problem: "These women's bodies look like mine/I wish I was comfortable like/looked like this"

I think probably about 99% of infidelity is connected to validation in some form or another. It’s unhealthy validation, but validation anyway. Validation is generally fine. We are pleased when our kids get good grades and make the Dean’s list because that’s validation for them and motivates them. We get a kick out of being employee of the month, or someone commenting about our weight-loss. We might enjoy our neighbor commenting about our brand-new vehicle... In a relationship we get validation through sex and intimacy, through being trusted, our spouse and children wanting to be near us... We might get validation having a healthy bank-account. All sorts of healthy and normal forms of validation.
I think a lot of affairs start because the WS is seeking validation that the OP offers. If your WW has body-issues she might get a kick out of the affirmation the OP offers. Even that is affirmation in comparing other bodies/nudes. Maybe she should be looking into ways of self-validating herself in a healthy way. Like... there should be some validation in you not disposing of her despite what she did.

Another issue: Reevaluate what is considered a "sexual" affair.
I don’t concur that an affair is non-sexual simply because there hasn’t been any physical contact, or no intercourse. In my view, once one or both take any action that is intended to cause sexual stimulation then the affair has crossed from emotional to sexual.
If your wife was sexting and sharing photos... as long as the content had the intent of stimulating him or her – it’s sexual IMHO. That it’s through a keyboard... not the issue for me.
Imagine this scenario: If your wife was standing behind a closed door, sharing sexual content and descriptions with the OM only a yard away, but on the other side of the door, and you had reason to suspect one or both was stimulating themselves at the same time. Would that be sexual? With sexting then all that really changes is the modus operandi.

Not pointing this out to make things harder. I think all recovery and/or whatever decision you reach should be based on as realistic a evaluation as possible. Considering her actions "non-sexual" would be a dash of rug-sweeping. They had sexual intentions.

Having said that – and trying to avoid any attempt to quantify causes of infidelity pain – I would think recovering from this type of a sex-act would be less of a call than recovering from what we "normally" consider sex. But that’s sort-of like suggesting being punched in the stomach is better than being kicked in the goonies.