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Or if going through a painful divorce, custody battle, and more financial stress is the right path forward. I didn't chose this, but now I'm stuck dealing with it.

I’m sorry OP, but your wife is categorically NOT a candidate for R now, nor may she ever be. If you’re desperately set on remaining married to what you now realize is a fictional person, you’re going to need ongoing IC, potentially forever, to help deal with someone who’s not honest with you, who blames you for everything, who doesn’t respect you in the least, and may even infect you (if she hasn’t already) with an STD. Is that how you want to live?

I know my view about this is not favored on this site, but some of us know your best shot at POSSIBLY turning things around would be to start the separation and D process NOW. If 10 miracles occur, and your wife absolutely TRANSFORMS her inner character, comes COMPLETELY clean regarding ALL she’s done (how can you forgive what you don’t know?), owns 100% of her adultery and the thousands of betrayal choices & actions without blaming you or the marriage for ANY of it, is willing to accept the natural consequences of her actions without protest, and basically becomes willing to crawl on broken glass for you, for as long as you need, well THEN and only then, might you consider stopping the D.

Here’s the key: if she doesn’t miraculously transform, and most likely she won’t, you need to value yourself high enough to recognize you don’t deserve ongoing abuse, and let’s be clear here: adultery is abuse. Blame shifting is continuing that abuse. You need to love yourself enough to truly believe you deserve better than this. And from what you’ve written, getting better than this is a very low bar for your next relationship.

Gr8ful:

I appreciate your insight. I'm aware of all of this. My last post was more so grasping the reality of the situation. After d-day, I really never sat in the pain and gave myself time to grieve this relationship. I recognize that this is a disaster, and this woman really doesn't want in a relationship with me. Just from the research I've done, I see all the red flags. No, I don't want a life of misery and uncertainty, especially at my age. I've already started the process of legal consultations to see my options moving forward.

I don't take any of the feedback here in a negative way. You all have way more experience with this than me. It just sucks to be in this position.

If every discussion you’re having with her right now just generates more blame shifting and excuses and strife, just stop. At least for now. It doesn’t sound like you can get anywhere with her at the moment anyway. Start using the 180 to help get yourself recentered and as calm as you can be. That’s where the good decisions are made.

I've already started the process of legal consultations to see my options moving forward.

Excellent move

He is severely overweight, doesn't have a great career, and even has some serious criminal charges that are going to land him as a registered sex offender once sentenced

This is the first thing you tell your new attorney. Sorry to state the obvious, but the lawyer’s first step is to get a restraining order to keep this piece of 💩 far away from your kids.

Reconciliation is a good thing only if you have something to work with, if the person who is your partner is still worthy, no matter how low in the sewage they went with the infidelity. When there is some good in a person that can rise back.

You don’t seem to have much to work with her for what I read.

Let her go, she is a body. That’s easily replaceable with a body that has a lovable woman inside and not someone who is fille to the brim full of… 💩

He is severely overweight, doesn't have a great career, and even has some serious criminal charges that are going to land him as a registered sex offender once sentenced

Kindred spirits. Her body will follow suit and erode to match her soul mate, don’t worry give her few years you wouldn’t go back there even if they pay you.

What’s inside will slowly emerge and transform you in the outside. Give it time.

This is the first thing you tell your new attorney. Sorry to state the obvious, but the lawyer’s first step is to get a restraining order to keep this piece of 💩 far away from your kids.

Absolutely.
Have no mercy, use it to cut her off the kids if she’s a toxic influence on them.

You come first. But you are the bulwark of your kids. They come even before us until they can fend for themselves.

She wants to be fucked by a degenerate pedophile?
Fine let her me the main course. But surely your children will never be the side dish.

By the way if that’s true I would never ever even consider to stick mine in a place where there was this piece of shit’s.

STD check and keep your dress on. She is not worthy.

Thanks for the advice, guys. I'm just taking things one day at a time.

I'm just done playing the mental games. I'm no longer going to be manipulated, and I'm not accepting the fake accountability. The "I messed up and its on all on me, but..."

There is no legitimate excuse for cheating. If things are that bad in the relationship, just leave. Don't pretend that everything is great while you carry out some type of twisted fantasy relationship behind closed doors. Its just funny that once they get caught, all of sudden they weren't happy for years. Once you take off the blinders, you start to see things for how they really are.

What do I have to lose that I haven't already lost? What am I fighting for?

Being the nice guy has gotten me nowhere. That's obvious.

[This message edited by Icedale31 at 1:49 PM, Wednesday, June 17th]

There is no legitimate excuse for cheating. If things are that bad in the relationship, just leave. Don't pretend that everything is great while you carry out some type of twisted fantasy relationship behind closed doors. Its just funny that once they get caught, all of sudden they weren't happy for years. Once you take off the blinders, you start to see things for how they really are.

What do I have to lose that I haven't already lost? What am I fighting for?

Being the nice guy has gotten me nowhere. That's obvious.

Proud of you Ice. You’re getting it so much faster than most. Stay strong!

Dale,

You are like a homing missle looking and thinking the right way. It’s incredibly hard to do with all of the emotions swirling.

Your wife is currently not a candidate for reconciliation. Your only real option at this point is lawyering up. You’ve been trying to lead a horse to water and it’s not working. You can’t force her, because then it really wouldn’t work. Shockingly, this is a blessing. You have nothing to second guess at this point

I appreciate it, guys.

I'm trying to approach this with clarity. I wish I could get this woman to see what's right infront of her, but it's obvious that she either doesn't want to, or is just incapable. Its really discouraging to see someone you love care about one thing, and one thing only, themselves. I'm a firm believer that everything happens for a reason. Maybe this is a blessing in disguise?

Either way, what a shitty hand I've been dealt.

I appreciate it, guys.

I'm trying to approach this with clarity. I wish I could get this woman to see what's right infront of her, but it's obvious that she either doesn't want to, or is just incapable. Its really discouraging to see someone you love care about one thing, and one thing only, themselves. I'm a firm believer that everything happens for a reason. Maybe this is a blessing in disguise?

Either way, what a shitty hand I've been dealt.

I like your clarity too.

Look she might not be able to see it now, or she might have never been able to see or care about the evil and pain she might choose to cause.

The issues she Carrie’s are something only she can confront, with help or not, but nobody can extract her those by force.

She is the only person who can decide that something is wrong with her and she has to fix it.

You wish she was different. Brother I get it.
I wish my wife was different too.

But if they only were they wouldn’t have fucked another guy p, we would not be betrayed partners and very likely we would not be here.

Makes sense?

When we are dealt a shitty hand at poker we still have one solution:

Discard it all.

Makes perfect sense, Storm.

Discarding it is the reality I'm sitting with now. Does it suck? Absolutely. But do I want to live with the betrayal, disrespect, and lack of accountability from a woman who wants to just sweep it under the rug and makes empty promises? A woman who is still more concerned with prioritizing her image, her own feelings, and her own comfort? Absolutely not. That's not the life I want to live, and certainly not a life I want my kids to live.

Although she dismisses, the statistics are out there for a reason. Her actions are red flag after red flag. All signs that lead to a road of someone who WILL do this again. Fool me once, shame on you;fool me twice, shame on me.

I'm not going down that road, I can't. So, unless she wants to dig deep and do the work, this thing is doomed.

I wish I could get this woman to see what's right infront of her, but it's obvious that she either doesn't want to, or is just incapable

Icedale,

That's not your job, simply. She'll have to realize that and at some point she will. By that time it will probably be too late. It will probably start to dawn on her when she is writing her first retainer check or handing over her credit card to her divorce lawyer.

Read up and implement a hard 180 on your WW. Only talk about issues regarding your kids and then keep it short. Decide who is responsible and on what days of the week to feed the kids, transportation issues and other day to day matters. Make and keep to that schedule. Cook your own meals on days when she's responsible for your kids.

Are you still sharing a bed with your WW at night? End that. Have her move to the guest room or the couch. If she bitches and refuses, tell her to pack an overnight bag and you will drive her to her boyfriend's house. He can deal with her now. She has a boyfriend she can go to, you don't.

Once you get your attorney's ok (you can ask about this in any initial consultation,) start separating financials. If they are not already separated, open up your own separate bank account and deposit your paychecks into that account. Have a brief discussion with your WW about her need to get her own account and then the creation of a joint account that you will each contribute 50% for the shared expenses.

I know at this stage it is hard NOT to talk about the affair, incredibly hard. In your WW's current blame-shifting and marriage rewriting phase, you MUST do it. It is not rug-sweeping if you implement a hard 180 with your wife. It may take several days but if you remain a gray rock to your wife, she will realize that she is losing control of the situation. At that point, she may start to realize what she may lose and change her attitude. Or she digs in; and in that case, you have your answer and drop the pedal on the divorce case.

Keep contacting/consulting lawyers. While you may want to avoid your kids from finding out, I wouldn't necessarily work too hard to keep it a secret from your wife. In fact, you may tell your wife that she needs to be available to watch the kids when you have a lawyer consultation. Tell her you will be willing to do the same when she needs to visit her attorney. MAKE IT REAL FOR HER.

You must realize that the one that is willing to walk away and end the marriage HAS ALL THE POWER in the relationship.

You must realize that the one that is willing to walk away and end the marriage HAS ALL THE POWER in the relationship.

There's a saying here. Sometimes to save your marriage you have to be willing to let it go.

I have no clue what your wife may or may not do if you take a hard stance, but I know that's what snapped my wife out of it. I spent about a month doing the pick me dance and realized it wasn't getting me anywhere. When I discovered what was happening she stopped physical activities with her AP, but still kept in contact with him over messenger and phone calls as "just friends." She was also working with him. Different departments and opposite shifts, but there was still some minimal contact at work. I foolishly let it happen thinking I didn't want to be the type of controlling asshole who tells his wife who she can and can't be friends with. She was also blame shifting and calling the shots on reconciliation.

After about a month of that I couldn't take it anymore. I resigned myself to divorce and told her that if she wants him she can have him. Just not while remaining married to me. I then proceeded to call lawyers and real estate agents right in front of her and set up some consultations. I think at first she thought I was bluffing, but then I started talking logistics and let her know I was dead serious. I'm not sharing my wife with anyone, and I'm done taking the blame for her shitty choices.

That changed everything. She begged me to not go through with it, sent him a no contact message, blocked him on everything, put in for a location transfer at work, then rolled up her sleeves and started doing real work on fixing what she'd broken. That was over a year ago. I've been in the drivers seat ever since, and she became a model wife for reconciliation. There has been absolutely no contact between she and him, she's taken full responsibility for her actions and in fact hates AP's guts now.

I don't know what your wife might do if you do something like that, but I didn't care what mine did. I wanted out of infidelity, and I was tired of taking the blame while being completely crushed by her choices. I just realized that there are worse things than divorce.

[This message edited by Pogre at 5:14 PM, Thursday, June 18th]

Fool me once, shame on you;fool me twice, shame on me.

How about fool me dozen of times? Should I be shamed?
Joking obviously, I felt mortally shamed at the first, didn’t need to get at the 12th. There might be even more but it doesn’t really matter after the first.

Take it from someone who saw the red flags 🚩 and ignored them.
Your gut is your best friend here.

If it tells you there is no remorse, that she will not change, trust it.

It will save you a truckload of pain and time you might find worthy to dedicate to a much worthier woman.

Great advice from Pogre. Yes, this is a shitty situation you never asked for, and for your children as well. Infidelity is very unfair to the BS, and there is no getting even. I second the advice to do the 180. I also agree that given your WW’s current attitude, risking the M in order to have any chance to save it is appropriate. Keep moving forward. See an attorney. Learn your rights. Pogre and others have given you a great example. If she doesn’t snap out of it, at least you have taken steps to get control of the situation and put yourself on the path to get out of infidelity. Good luck.

Awesome advice everyone!

I skimmed over the 180 technique, but I'll have to do a deep dive. At this point? What do I have to lose? If she wants to walk, it is what it is. I don't want a wife who doesn't want me anyways.

I'll start implementing this and let everyone know how it unfolds. I appreciate you all for the great advice, and entertaining me while I vent about my situation.

Icedale,

I wanted to chime in with a little explanation of why you’re getting so much pushing right now.

Everyone’s goal here is to help you get out of infidelity. Simplistically, there are only two paths out of infidelity: divorce and reconciliation.

But those aren’t the only two paths. You could end up, like so many others before you, in some kind of rugswept limbo. That is the worst possible outcome.

What everyone is seeing is that: (1) you have exactly the right attitude. You know your self-worth, and you won’t accept being treated badly; (2) your WW has shown that she’s not currently a candidate for R; and (3) you have no plan - you’re taking things "day by day".

That day by day thing is not great, because it runs the risk of engendering complacency. You adapt to the new relationship and as time passes it normalizes. You’re unhappy but there’s always something - a big work project, a sick kid, visiting grandparents, the holidays, and on and on. Weeks, then months, then more time passes.

You probably don’t feel ready to make a decision yet. That’s fine! Take the time you need. But have a plan in place. Maybe pull out a calendar and lay down some milestones for yourself. The point of these milestones is not to give to her to check items off the list; it’s to keep yourself accountable to your own well being. It’s to make sure you don’t just drift along hoping she snaps out of it.

Some potential milestones: her STD test; her NC letter; her written timeline + polygraph; sustained and consistent remorse without blame-shifting etc.

In the meantime, do the 180 everyone keeps telling you to do. Meet your lawyer and get your ducks in a row. Having a plan in place will make you feel better and more in control.

PS. Some of your WW’s behavior makes me wonder if the A is really over.

Letmebefrank:

I appreciate the explanation.

I'll take all the advice I can get on this one. I'll start on the 180 ASAP. As far as the other stuff goes, I have most of it in motion already. I've already had one legal consultation and have a few more scheduled within the next week. I also went and got a STD test myself this week (what a joy).

I'll make an effort to put a plan together.

As far as the affair still going, I haven't seen any evidence of this unless she's using a burner phone or something. But I've been wondering this as well...

If she is still in contact with him, there is absolutely nothing to save here. Her AP was a disgusting human being, inside and out.

I'll start on the 180 ASAP.

Excellent. Sorry to pry but what's ya'lls sleeping arrangements? Do you have a spare bedroom or will it be sleeping on the couch? I ask because the most direct way to show your wife you're serious is by refusing to share the marital bed. While I suggested kicking her out, it will be difficult to get her to agree so you may be the one moving. It will be difficult for you and she may beg for you to return. Simply tell her you refuse to share a bed with an adulterous wife and head to the other room or couch. It may cause your kids to ask some questions, simply tell the children "You need to ask your mother those questions"

While the 180/gray rock will show your wife you are serious about this situation that is not the intended reason for the 180 method. It is not a manipulation technique (but its a great unintended consequence of it.) The 180 is for you to reduce your emotional attachment to your WW. While implementing the 180, take some time to think about everything and where you want to go from here while being emotionally separated from your WW. I know as a male there is an almost a base emotion or instinctive reaction "to win" or "beat" the AP/OM by keeping your wife. Take the time to consider what exactly you are fighting for and trying to "win" in your situation.

Say your wife completely flips and comes to you begging and crying to keep the marriage while promising on the lives of her children to have no contact with the AP ever again, what have you really won? A woman that gives her heart and emotions to a disgusting, obese, potential criminal sloth of a man, all the while blaming you for her actions. Not to mention the nude pictures she sent him. I'm going to go out on a limb here (sarcastically,) but she probably didn't send you any nude pictures while she was sending them to the AP, did she? What exactly are you fighting for? If you knew she was capable of this before you proposed or got married, would you have gone through with the wedding? After everything, can you really say you're proud to call her your wife?

Don't you deserve someone that you can proudly and honestly call your wife?

Some may say that the kids (and family) and reducing financial hardship/destruction that a divorce will cause, is worth fighting for. To swallow the indignity and disrespect in order to have more time with the children and not having a potential unknown step-dad enter the picture in the future. Unfortunately, this is the world most men find themselves in these situations. It sucks, no doubt about it. But as a child of divorced parents (because of infidelity on my dad's part) it can be done successfully where the children are not affected long-term by having two happy but divorced parents. Otherwise, you are damning yourself to a life of being a prison warden for your wife. While some trust may return, you will never trust her 100% ever again. Years from now, an off-hand comment made by your wife or some vague "feeling" may come over you at random, and you will be running to check the phone accounts or trying to secretly nab your wife's phone to go snooping again. Is that really a way to live? And she did this with a disgusting ex-boyfriend.. what happens when a new man with model good looks and the only thing fat about him is his bank account starts showing interest in your wife? How confidant can you really be that the WW keeps her boundaries?

You deserve better Icedale. Good luck with the 180.